Does haste (8085) or spell power win out of multi dot fights

[Ariadne]

MSV has high movement fights with generally many targets to dot, it's not hard to understand why he is choosing the reforge to mastery over crit. It's not like this is something extremely overworked, he's still gemming/reforging haste as the highest secondary stat.

I disagree. Which fight would you call high movement with many targets to dot? The only one I can think of would be Will of the Emperor Heroic but from what I've seen you don't move that much.

[Drye]

Stone guards- depending on how lucky you get with chains and how lucky you get with pools/bombs being on you very easily can become a high movement fight. specially if you get chained to melee and need to move almost nonstop while multi dotting.

Feng - Depending on which way you go, for the arcane phase you are almost always moving around. If you are the range that is soaking for the stun on the earth/lightning phase you will have to move a lot to avoid and then hit the stuns. This is probably the outlier for this.

Gara'jal - Depending on where totems spawn as a shadowpriest you should be going down so there will be a decent amount of moving every 30 seconds back and from the totems. With lots of multi dotting.

Spirit kings - The amount of movement on this fight is insane. I doubt I really need to explain more.

Elegon- much less movement but there still is a decent amount. But the amount of multi dotting is way up there. the %dmg buff might push mastery way over just the way it works.

Wote- Depending on your strat and even then you are nonstop moving and dotting you really don't have much time to do anything else during it.

As I originally stated, mastery very easily could overcome crit on these fights.

[Ariadne]

Sorry, thought you meant high movement fights and a lot of targets.

Stone Guard - More often than not you don't get chained to a melee. So I don't see any point reforging for high movement when low movement happens more often.

Feng the Accursed - Single target fight.

Spiritbinder - You go down maybe four times, that's like 6 GCDs for moving. I wouldn't say that is high movement fight. And you have to remember, during progression damage on boss is usually the issue, not on adds downstairs.

Spirit Kings - Okay, it is a bit of movement but you only have a lot of targets during shadow phase.

Elegon - I would not say it is high movement here. Phase 1, you stand still and DPS boss and protectors. Phase 2, you stand still and DPS boss and then sparks. Phase 3, you stand still and DPS three pillars. You move a bit when you are waiting for platform to respawn after phase 3 I guess.

And VT and SWP aren't overrepresented in top logs on these fights.

[Drye]

On our first stone guard kill I was chained to melee for close to 80% of the fight and it was the worst experience i have ever had since Heroic spine pre-nerf. And like I said, it's very possbile mastery will win out. It's only what 3 weeks into raiding that we've had. People really need more experience/numbers to get what is really better, specially with them being so close. Now, I'm not saying to go and do haste>mastery>crit, I;m just simply saying it's a very high possibility that on fights mastery>crit. Everything really comes down to RNG on fights.

[Ariadne]

Yeah but you are forgetting all those other tries before your kill. The chances of you being chained to a melee 80% of the fight is very small. Gearing for it does not make sense for me. I think the best way to gear is to gear for the most likely scenario, which is not getting chained to a melee. And I agree, it really sucks to be chained on that fight.

I don't sim a lot myself and don't read much theorycrafting but haven't sims shown that unless VT and SWP is a very large part of our damage, crit>mastery?

[Drye]

Yeah but you are forgetting all those other tries before your kill. The chances of you being chained to a melee 80% of the fight is very small. Gearing for it does not make sense for me. I think the best way to gear is to gear for the most likely scenario, which is not getting chained to a melee. And I agree, it really sucks to be chained on that fight.

I don't sim a lot myself and don't read much theorycrafting but haven't sims shown that unless VT and SWP is a very large part of our damage, crit>mastery?

I was chained twice this week to melee, so it does happen a decent amount, like I said it's really RNG and how lucky you can get. And yes, it really depends on the rest of the dmg too. Just because sw;p/vt might be a large portion of your dmg you really need to see if its more than, i would say ~51% of your dmg because depending on your talents he rest of your dmg portion could be doing more, it's just not as noticeable.

[Zipples]

haven't sims shown that unless VT and SWP is a very large part of our damage, crit>mastery?

I think this is where your misguided though Ariadne. When heavy movement comes into play mastery takes a large lead over crit and in light movement mastery and crit are near identical. This lends it's self to favor mastery over crit because you can reforge for the whole instance. This ends up benefiting you more because of all the movement in MSV. This is what I have gathered from reading logs and simming my own gear. Mind you my ilvl is quite low at the moment(475) but I feel if you sim your own gear in all fight circumstances you will see that the dps gain you get on more static fights from reforging crit will actually lose out to the dps gain you get on movement fights from mastery.

[Ariadne]

haven't sims shown that unless VT and SWP is a very large part of our damage, crit>mastery?

I think this is where your misguided though Ariadne. When heavy movement comes into play mastery takes a large lead over crit and in light movement mastery and crit are near identical. This lends it's self to favor mastery over crit because you can reforge for the whole instance. This ends up benefiting you more because of all the movement in MSV. This is what I have gathered from reading logs and simming my own gear. Mind you my ilvl is quite low at the moment(475) but I feel if you sim your own gear in all fight circumstances you will see that the dps gain you get on more static fights from reforging crit will actually lose out to the dps gain you get on movement fights from mastery.

There are hardly any movement fights with many targets though. And I can't be arsed to to sim my character. Too much work for too little gain.

[aica]

haven't sims shown that unless VT and SWP is a very large part of our damage, crit>mastery?

I think this is where your misguided though Ariadne. When heavy movement comes into play mastery takes a large lead over crit and in light movement mastery and crit are near identical. This lends it's self to favor mastery over crit because you can reforge for the whole instance. This ends up benefiting you more because of all the movement in MSV. This is what I have gathered from reading logs and simming my own gear. Mind you my ilvl is quite low at the moment(475) but I feel if you sim your own gear in all fight circumstances you will see that the dps gain you get on more static fights from reforging crit will actually lose out to the dps gain you get on movement fights from mastery.

I don't see that with my sims. It took heavy movement with >1 target in order for that to happen, and there aren't any fights with the super heavy movement conditions that sim usees.

[Veiled]

I don't see that with my sims. It took heavy movement with >1 target in order for that to happen, and there aren't any fights with the super heavy movement conditions that sim usees.

This.

Crit>Mastery unless under very specific and special circumstances.. I could see mastery being useful in extremely high movement and 3+ targets maybe?